Author Topic: So does the Z-Temp HE make it unable to use official Zortrax filament?  (Read 30410 times)

washawaytheblood

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So does the Z-Temp HE make it unable to use official Zortrax filament? I tried Ultrat and it comes out like Garbage.

Padraicsdad

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I'm sure Julia will answer this but FWIW, during the limited time I've been using the Z-Temp and ZT-HE my Zortrax M200 has printed Z-ABS and Z-UltraT at least as well as it did before I installed them. BTW, I figured "in for a penny" so I also added the extruder block insulating blanket.

PS - Check your upper (cool-end) fan. I apparently damaged mine and experienced rafts that were impossible to remove and some stringing.
« Last Edit: June 05, 2016, 09:54:04 AM by Padraicsdad »

z-renegade

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So does the Z-Temp HE make it unable to use official Zortrax filament?

Definitely no, I print original Z-Filaments also (Z-ABS right now).

I tried Ultrat and it comes out like Garbage.

What filament did you print before, how much filament did you purge if it was low temp filament?
Easiest check would be to swap the nozzle (use a new one).

Julia Truchsess

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It certainly doesn't make it "unable" to print Z materials, but there may be subtle differences in surface finish or stringing due to ZT-HE's lower friction and slightly different melt chamber. I don't use Z materials much at all, and gave up UltraT long before ZT-HE existed. I have been printing a fair amount of Up ABS lately, which is very similar to Z-ABS. I usually print it at 260º and it's working fine for me.
"Character is doing what's right when nobody's looking." - JC Watts Jr

washawaytheblood

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Subtle? did you look at my included picture?


It certainly doesn't make it "unable" to print Z materials, but there may be subtle differences in surface finish or stringing due to ZT-HE's lower friction and slightly different melt chamber. I don't use Z materials much at all, and gave up UltraT long before ZT-HE existed. I have been printing a fair amount of Up ABS lately, which is very similar to Z-ABS. I usually print it at 260º and it's working fine for me.

washawaytheblood

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It was the first filament I ran through it. So both the nozzle and Hot End were new. I didn't see the insulator kit when I purchased the HE and to buy it after costs more to ship than the item itself.

So does the Z-Temp HE make it unable to use official Zortrax filament?

Definitely no, I print original Z-Filaments also (Z-ABS right now).

I tried Ultrat and it comes out like Garbage.

What filament did you print before, how much filament did you purge if it was low temp filament?
Easiest check would be to swap the nozzle (use a new one).

Julia Truchsess

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Subtle? did you look at my included picture?

Yes, I saw the picture, but without a comparison of the same print using the same material and same settings with the Zortrax hot end, I can't tell if the differences are subtle or not. The difference between the ZT-HE and the Zortrax hot end are that the ZT-HE has a better heat break, its PTFE tube goes all the way down to the nozzle, and the melt chamber is a slightly different shape. I'd be surprised if these differences made a huge change in the way Z materials print (the ZT-HE's construction is used in many other printers), but I've been surprised by things before.

The main effect of the insulator is to reduce the temperature drop when the fan(s) first come on, which is mostly only an issue when printing right at the lower end of a material's useful range; I don't think it has much if any effect on print quality. Some claim that it reduces curling of thin top layers due to less downward-radiated heat.
"Character is doing what's right when nobody's looking." - JC Watts Jr

z-renegade

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It was the first filament I ran through it. So both the nozzle and Hot End were new. I didn't see the insulator kit when I purchased the HE and to buy it after costs more to ship than the item itself.

I have an insulator kit, never used it.

What Z-Temp offset and Z-Suite filament did you use?
And if it was zero offset (Z-Temp) and Z-ULTRAT profile (Z-Suite), did this spool print o.k. before on original hotend with same Z-Code?

washawaytheblood

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Yeah it looked great before. This is the test file that comes on the SD Card

It was the first filament I ran through it. So both the nozzle and Hot End were new. I didn't see the insulator kit when I purchased the HE and to buy it after costs more to ship than the item itself.

I have an insulator kit, never used it.

What Z-Temp offset and Z-Suite filament did you use?
And if it was zero offset (Z-Temp) and Z-ULTRAT profile (Z-Suite), did this spool print o.k. before on original hotend with same Z-Code?

z-renegade

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I don't know this test file, the files on my SD Card were useless (couldn't be printed) so I deleted them more than a year ago.

You could try to lower the temp by steps of 10° centigrade and try again.

I could give the Z-Code a try but I fear I don't have Z-ULTRAT in my closet (will check).
To me those Z-Filaments are completely useless (except Z-ABS).

Padraicsdad

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I printed a 20mm Z-ABS test cube before starting to install the Z-Temp mods, then again after the Z-Temp unit, bed heat switch, ZT-HE and the insulating blanket were in place. For the latter I sliced with the Z-ABS profile then used zero Z-Temp offset and full bed heat (position 3). Admittedly, 20mm cubes aren't the most stringent test but if there is any significant difference between the before and after cubes and a baseline cube I printed weeks ago I can't see it.

In the attached photo the baseline cube is on the left, before is center and after is on the right. If anything, the one on the right looks very slightly better under a glass. All three measure the same with sides being an avg. of about 19.949mm. Close enough!

z-renegade

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Admittedly, 20mm cubes aren't the most stringent test but if there is any significant difference between the before and after cubes and a baseline cube I printed weeks ago I can't see it.

The issue of the OP is about print quality of a more complex object. It's about stringing / retraction / temp / filament viscosity...


z-renegade

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Yeah it looked great before. This is the test file that comes on the SD Card

Don't have Z-ULTRAT, but could give it a first try with Z-ABS.
Can you share the Z-Code you used?

zen17h

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I've used the same model for test prints during each step of the upgrade process (Zcode also attached in the link).
http://www.z-temp.co/forum/index.php?topic=37.0
This also included the extruder block insulator, which you can probably easily make yourself with some high-temperature resistant ?stuff? and O-bands from any hardware store

Aside from already having installed windows and doing the later prints at a -10ºC offset (I'm not sure if it makes a big difference but tried to stay mostly below 260ºC), my printer was also stock and I used default settings at the start. I noticed no major differences between my prints for each step taken

Julia Truchsess

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Yes, you can certainly make your own insulators if you can find the right material. I wouldn't recommend hardware-store o-rings, as they're likely to be nitrile rubber which doesn't tolerate high temperature well. We ship silicone o-rings.
"Character is doing what's right when nobody's looking." - JC Watts Jr